Safari 3.0 Windows

Yesterday I downloaded Safari 3.0 Windows as soon as I found out it was available. It looks fine. Below you find a list of CSS changes, as well as a curious bug that appears on a minority of Windows systems.

CSS support changes

Changes relative to 1.3.2:

I haven't yet updated the CSS compatibility table because this is a beta release.

Bugs

Update: The bugs below only occur on a few computers, among which my desktop one. Safari 3.0 Windows runs OK on my laptop. Graphic card problems were suggested as the source of the odd behaviour.

First of all, although the loading of pages may be ultra-fast, as Apple maintains, it's slow to react to the mouse wheel and Alt+Tab. The interaction may become much smoother; I hope so at least.

[outdated] On the coding side of things I'm distinctly unimpressed because of a very serious bug: Safari 3.0 Windows just doesn't render the text inside any header, <em> or <strong> tag on my site. I briefly checked a few other sites, and a similar problem occurs there, too. See for instance CSS Zen Garden: there are lots of text bits missing (at least, on my computer).

CSS Zen Garden in Safari 3.0 Windows

This is the blog of Peter-Paul Koch, mobile platform strategist, consultant, and trainer. You can also follow him on Twitter.
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1 Posted by Z DuLac on 12 June 2007 | Permalink

On my own PC, both Zen Garden and your site render fine. I'm curious if it's a problem specific to your PC ... maybe a graphic card driver issue? Or maybe your hardware isn't Apple Certified (TM) :-)

It takes a while to startup though ...

2 Posted by Mike on 12 June 2007 | Permalink

I am also rendering both sites just fine with Safari 3.0 on Windows XP. Just contributing to the paranoia...

3 Posted by Jonne on 12 June 2007 | Permalink

I have the same issue, on an iMac running Windows with an ATI Radeon X1600 (?) card. I don't recall seeing the same thing when I tried it in VMWare on my Ubuntu laptop (which has an Nvidia card using the restricted drivers).

If you have an ATI card too, that might be why.

(PS: for some reason I can't post my homepage because of 'questionable content', you might want to check that thing, it took me a while to track down what might've been 'questionable' about my post)

4 Posted by Joris von Loghausen on 12 June 2007 | Permalink

Funny enough, Safari crashes every single time I press the bookmarkish button on the top left on my work pc. Then again, iTunes plays every file as a nice stream of white noise so there might be something fundamentally wrong with my apple foundation on that pc.

5 Posted by ppk on 12 June 2007 | Permalink

I installed it on my laptop, and there both sites work correctly. So I assume that something odd on my desktop box causes the problem; and yes, I do have graphic card problems.

Unfortunately I'm really bad at debugging hardware, so this is something for my sysadmin the next time he comes around.

Will update main post shortly.

6 Posted by Jordan West on 12 June 2007 | Permalink

It still really frustrates me that in safari you have to turn the debug menu on! I just want the javascript error console. Anyone know how to turn it on for windows? Also, Mac apps just dont look as appealing to me on a windows machine. I am interested to see how this will run on Vista. Ill try when I can get on my box at home and post an update.

Also, both sites work fine for me. PPK any chance you'll be adding Safari 3.0 to the compatability tables when its actually released in October?

7 Posted by Mathieu Kooiman on 12 June 2007 | Permalink

I've been in #webkit on irc.freenode.net for a bit today and it turns out WebKit has issues with localized versions of Windows (XP).

Safari 3 beta on my home machine (Windows XP, dutch) can't render my own site, Google Reader or Digg properly while Safari 3 beta on my work machine (Windows XP, english) is doing all things pretty well and fast.

@ppk: So, this may be the case for you too.

@Jordan: you can activate the menu by entering:

<key>IncludeDebugMenu</key>
<true/>

just before the line with </dict> in C:\Document and Settings\%USERNAME%\Application Data\Apple Computer\Safari\Preferences.plist
and then restarting Safari.

8 Posted by Riddle on 12 June 2007 | Permalink

To solve problem with bold text (Arial to be exact - Lucida Grande / Trebuchet MS renders fine) you can go to

Control Panel > Region and Language Settings > Advanced > Language used when app doesn't use Unicode > English (USA) and you need to restart your system.

The side-effect is that all of your non-Unicode apps in system won't render national characters.

Someone advised to use AppLocale from MS to emulate this Unicode enviroment only for Safari, but it isn't working for me.

9 Posted by Riddle on 12 June 2007 | Permalink

Oh and if you want to enable bookmarks & help go to Safari location and copy/rename all "en.lproj" folders to "pl.lproj" where "pl" is abbr of your language (nl, de, fr, etc).

These issues exist only in localized versions of Windows (Polish XP here).

10 Posted by robert on 12 June 2007 | Permalink

Same problem on my laptop - hp nx7010 with an ATI card

11 Posted by Lanza on 12 June 2007 | Permalink

It seems to be a font/text-encoding bug. On my installation those elements are rendered, but with weird fonts.

12 Posted by Vincent Pickering on 13 June 2007 | Permalink

I have a problem which may be related to this. I have an ATI Radeon X300, and i cant even use the Safari download. Upon running it, no menus appear, no UI at all infact, the browser bar is unresponsive and wont allow me to type url's either. I guess i have to try downloading the nightly builds and hope the gfx card issue is fixed and i can atleast have a go at using Safari!

13 Posted by Masklinn on 13 June 2007 | Permalink

PPK, I don't know how the Windows beta relates to the "original" OSX Safari (I'm under the impression that it blows, while Webkit has been very stable in my experience), but I think you should try to use the main OSX trunk if you want to update the CSS compatibility tables for Safari 3 (you can find nightly builds at http://webkit.org/).

The community can probably help with that if you need it (I'd be glad to).

Also note that while I'm not sure the CSS support has changed that much since Safari 2 (some stuff was added/modified e.g. in the CSS 3 support), the Javascript support has been drastically altered and has gone from "far behind MSIE" to Firefox/Opera levels of quality (JS under Safari 2 is a pain, JS under Webkit is a breeze, even w/o taking Drosera in account).

If you want me to go through your test suites with a recent OSX Webkit build, mail me, I'll be glad to do it.

14 Posted by Jordan West on 13 June 2007 | Permalink

So I installed the beta on Vista. It is identical to how it looks on XP. I have to admit im slightly disappointed in that respect, because i was expecting atleast some incorporation of the aero windows. As for running, it took longer to start up on my Vista machine than it did on my XP box. Besides that i didnt get any wierd errors or see any differences between the two.

15 Posted by Chris Hester on 13 June 2007 | Permalink

No fonts, crashes... sadly unusable for me. Read my account:

http://www.designdetector.com/2007/06/apple-safari-3-beta-problems-on-windows.php

16 Posted by AntonN on 13 June 2007 | Permalink

i have the same expirience with safari in csszengarden: text is missing :(

i got windows XP SP2 and nvidia geforce 7600 GS

17 Posted by Zoltar Alebabka on 14 June 2007 | Permalink

Robert that's normal. I use laptop with Intel graphic chip Intel 945GM and it crashes even on old games:)

18 Posted by Jordan West on 18 June 2007 | Permalink

I couldn't find the preferences.plist file using a search in windows vista. Anyone know where it is or what it also may be called on Vista.

Thanks,

Jordan

19 Posted by Alistair Potts on 18 June 2007 | Permalink

Jordan -

Vista location of the Safari preferences file is:

C:\Users\%USERNAME%\AppData\Roaming\Apple Computer\Safari\Preferences.plist

... or at least that's where it is for me on a clean install.

Hope that helps!

20 Posted by Miro on 19 June 2007 | Permalink

I try to safari 3 for windows. It crashes all the time.

Miro

21 Posted by Fouad Masoud on 19 June 2007 | Permalink

i haven't faced any problems with rendering English sites, yet there is the thing of Arabic text it comes out broken and reversed.

another thing every time i try to use bookmarks the browser crashes, and on my work PC when i try to change the network settings it crashes 2.

22 Posted by Dan From on 21 June 2007 | Permalink

I to have some layout problems with safari on windows. If i have some div's with font-weight: bold, it will not be shown.

Hope the final version soon will come

23 Posted by Estelle on 30 June 2007 | Permalink

I tested the CSS selectors on Windows XP with Safari 3.0. Safari 3.0 support the pseudo element of :first-of-type. http://www.evotech.net/blog/2007/04/css-selectors-and-browser-support/ has a table that includes Safari 3.0 CSS support.

Since Safari 3.0 is the only browser to support :first-of-type, it can be used as a non-future proof filter. Since that pseudo-class is part of the CSS3 specifications, I assume we will eventually see more browsers supporting it.

I listed some CSS Safari 3.0 hacks/filters at http://www.evotech.net/blog/2007/04/css-selectors-and-browser-support/.

24 Posted by Estelle on 30 June 2007 | Permalink

Oops, wrong link.http://www.evotech.net/blog/2007/06/targeting-safari-30-with-css/ has the Safari 3.0 filters/hacks .

25 Posted by Wally on 10 July 2007 | Permalink

Hey I have safari 3 beta running on my vista and there's no problems here.